Speaker 1 0:05
ANNOUNCER. This episode of the Canadian immigration podcast is sponsored by the Canadian immigration Institute, one of the best sources of video content on Canadian immigration to help you navigate your way through the Canadian immigration process. Head on over to the YouTube channel, where there's tons of video content, and you can join mark yes myself in a number of live video streams, Q and A's all designed to help you navigate your way through this crazy Canadian immigration process. When you're done there, like and subscribe and then head on over to the Canadian Immigration institute.com where you can find all those awesome DIY courses that I've been talking about. Thank you, Canadian immigration Institute. You are the sponsor of this amazing little podcast. You
Outro 1:05
the Canadian immigration process can be complex and frustrating, with the Canadian Immigration Department making it virtually impossible to speak to an officer. There are few places to turn to for trusted information. The Canadian immigration podcast was created to fill this void by offering the latest on immigration law, policy and practice. Please welcome ex immigration officer and Canadian immigration lawyer Mark Holthe as he is joined by industry leaders across Canada sharing insight to help you along your way.
Mark Holthe 1:51
Welcome back everyone to another episode of the Canadian immigration podcast. My name is Mark Holthe. I am the host of this fine little podcast that's been around for a little while. Alicia, it's been, I don't know, I think 2015 I launched the first one. So we've got 10 years running with this.
Alicia Backman-Beharry 2:10
Had an anniversary. There you go.
Mark Holthe 2:12
We do, I didn't even think about that. And you know what, we are July. It is entirely possible that the first one was actually launched in July. So we're excited to be back. It's been we've had a little bit of a hiatus. We've had a few things going on, but this is one we just absolutely had to do. We are actually resurrecting our business immigration series. So if you go back to, like, Episode 100 or something, we started a business immigration series where we talked about how to get a work permit. You know, the various options through the temporary foreign worker program, international mobility program, and now we are come full circle, because we are in a whole new world of lmias. So Alicia, what is going on with LMIA is in 2025
Alicia Backman-Beharry 2:55
Yeah, and so I really wanted to do this podcast, because I've been asked by a number of employers, is it still possible to even try to get an LMIA and if it's possible, how does it work now that there are new rules, and so we know that LMIA has changed significantly. There are new rules, it's much more difficult now to go through that LMIA process and get approved. So we wanted to talk about that. The other thing that's just happened. So we're in July now, and they've just released the updated wage rates. And so that happened as of June 27 2025 so this is very timely, because it's very, very important in whether you can even try for an LMIA. You need to understand whether you're trying for a high wage LMIA or a low wage LMIA. And of course, there are other LMIA. There are LMIA is for agricultural positions, and there are LMIA specifically like to support permanent residents. But those are different categories. So in general, we'll, we'll talk about the high wage low wage threshold, because that really makes a difference, given the changes to the cap and the unemployment rate and the refusal to process. So that's what we're really looking at. And so many, many people get extremely confused about, are we in a high wage or a low wage LMIA world? And the first thing to think about is, for a low wage, this is where you have to deal with the cap, right? So there's a cap on how many temporary foreign workers you can employ in relation to your Canadian staff, and then there's also a refusal to process. And so if you are in an unemployment rate that has unemployment in that census metropolitan area of higher than 6% it's a no go, unless you're in very niche industries. So other than that, it's very, very difficult to try to go for a low wage LMIA. And this, when people are thinking about what's a low wage LMIA, they often look at the median wage and Job Bank and they're like, Oh, well, it's higher than minimum wage. It. Must be fine. That's not the case. So this is the table. So Mark's got this pulled up for anybody who's listening. You can go to the ESDC website. It's called hire a temporary foreign worker in a high wage or low wage position. And if you scroll down on that page, you will see a table, and it says wage threshold by province or territory. And they've got, LMIA is received before June 27 2025 and now we're in the current reality. LMIA is received as of June 27 2025 and you'll see, for example, the cutoff for Alberta is $36 Coincidentally, the cutoff for Ontario is also $36 right now, as and BC is a little bit higher. It's $36.60 so these were all inflated a little bit up based on inflation, and they are now the cut off thresholds. So when you go to your knock for whichever job you want to try to get that LMIA positioned for as the employer, you will take a look at what the median Job Bank wage is for that knock, for the location in which you have that worker. If it is higher, let's use Alberta as an example, than $36 you are looking at a high wage situation. If it is lower than $36 you are looking at a low wage. You're subject to the caps. You're subject to the refusal to process by and large. So this is what I really want people to know. So that is the first test you go through to try to figure out, is an LMIA going to be possible for your company, for this position in the location that you want that worker to work, you can't get a general LMIA for somebody to work in multiple locations, you can't get an LMIA for multiple different not codes. It's one not code. That position has to maintain the same you're locked into the wages and the conditions of work. So that's really important to understand. The next thing is, well, let's say you are in the high wage world. What do you have to do? How long does it take to get an LMIA and many companies want to know you want to have your HR staff to be able to report to management to say, Can we get approval to go through this LMIA process? Well, it takes a long time, and it really depends on how sophisticated the company is, do you have an employer, job, bank account? Do you actually have your CRA number? Are you properly Incorporated? Do you have all your documents showing business legitimacy? Because you need all that before you can even go down the road. So when we're talking about processing times. The overview is, you can go to this page and it's an LMIA processing times, and theoretically they update it monthly. And so if you go to the ASTC page, we've got average processing times for June 2025, they haven't updated it yet for July, but you can see so global talent stream, those ought to be processed faster. Agricultural stream also has priority processing as well as the seasonal Agricultural Worker Program. But the main category that most employers are going to fall under is that high wage, low wage, and people basically know right now to stay very far away from the permanent residence stream LMIA is because those are taking basically a year. And when you look at these processing times, note that it says time in business days. So these are not just, you know, regular days. This is only active business days. So we'll see it was quite a bit higher at like 67 or 70 business days. It's come down maybe to 41 we'll see if this is actually what people are experiencing in real time, for actual processing times. But this is a little bit misleading. So when we look at these processing times, this does not take into account any of your advertising and recruiting period. So it's important that if you're an HR manager, or if you are a company who is looking at whether you want to go down the LMIA Road, understand that the LMIA is your responsibility as the employer. It has nothing to do with the employee taking on that task or the cost of an LMIA. So go back to our business immigration series, kind of starting around episode 100 super, super important in terms of compliance, that the employer is the one who's responsible for this entire LMIA process. It is related to your business account. You are on the hook for everything that you tell ESDC when there is an audit, everything that is written in here is going to be holding you to account. So how long does it take? Well, keep in mind the program requirements and maybe mark you can go over to the ESDC page, where it talks about high end. Low wage LMIA process, and you'll see what the program requirements are. And so under here, you can click the stream for high wage positions program requirements. And this is going to talk about All right, what do you have to do? So yes, there's a processing fee. If you're looking at submitting an LMIA, it's $1,000 the company has to pay this per application. And then you know, if you are using a recruiter, it must be a licensed, bonded, reputable recruiter. That recruiter is charging the company to try to find workers. It does not charge the potential candidates a penny. So no candidate should ever, ever, ever be paying anything for an LMIA, there has been a lot of fraud, and this is putting the whole LMIA in process in jeopardy for everybody who is a good actor and is not abusing the system, but make sure
Mark Holthe 10:51
that, and that's why things are just the way they are right now, such a mess. There was just so much fraud and abuse, and they did not properly vet companies. They were focusing on expediency, and so the program became exploited. We had the issue of the sale of job offers, which corrupted the express entry process and and that's why we're at it today the way we are, and processing has become very difficult. And you know, as we go through this list, Alicia with you know, each of these different categories. If we jump ahead, you know, the business legitimacy is a big issue right now. So it doesn't matter how big your company is. If it's a big multinational company, and you showed a loss on your profit loss for the the time period immediately preceding the date of your application, they've, you know, they've said, Well, we're going to refuse, or we require other evidence to show you can actually pay the worker that you're trying to bring in, even if you have 1500 workers working for your company already in Canada. So you have to watch for this stuff. And immigration are literally using every technique they can to find ways to refuse.
Alicia Backman-Beharry 12:00
So yeah. I mean, LMIA is and especially so picking up on what you said there Mark, what has happened with LMIA is, is that there are no longer LMIA job offer points in Express Entry, right? So part of the demand for LMIA is was driven by the fact that people could get 50, or in rare cases where they actually had a double zero knock, 200 points on their Express Entry profile, if they had a job offer and it met all the technical arranged employment requirements under the ministerial instructions and the regulations, they could get those points in express entry that significantly boosted their Express Entry score, and that was kind of their pathway to PR we know, in March of 2025 those arranged employment job offer points just got wiped out. Now please take a look at my article on our website. If you go to the holtheim law blog, then you'll be able to see that there is still value in claiming arranged employment, not because you get the bonus points, but because it can matter in your Federal Skilled Worker selection grid, and it can matter in terms of so can I claim a job offer in my Express Entry application? Is that second one? Yeah, updated after March 2025, so it can matter based on the FSW points grid, and it can matter based on whether or not you have to prove settlement funds. So if you have a job offer and it meets the arranged employment requirements, then that can make a difference in terms of whether or not you have to prove settlement funds. And that can be a big deal for people. But coming back to LMIA, so there was fraud, there was abuse of the system. Therefore they've changed. What happens with LMIA is, how long does it take? Well, if we go to the program requirements, this is where I was headed, Mark, if you go to the program requirements for recruitment and advertising, and this is, yeah, so recruitment and advertising, right there, you will see that there is a four week continuous requirement. And so minimum recruitment. You've got to have three different recruitment activities, one of which is you have to advertise on the Job Bank of Canada, unless you try to use an alternative method, and you have to submit a written rationale and an explanation of the alternative methods, which you may have to do now because Job Bank is being extremely difficult, and talk about that in a moment. But in addition to Job Bank, you also have to advertise and recruit for a high wage in at least two additional methods of recruitment consistent with the occupation, so you're targeting the correct audience, and one of the methods used must be national in scope and easily accessed by residents. So what they mean by that? So it says to be national in scope, Canadians and permanent residents can be able to search for that without having to go like a. Through a whole bunch of sub pages, so it says in a single site, as opposed to referring to individual or regional sub sites. So be really careful. If you are an employer, I would definitely recommend that you hire a lawyer who has assisted companies with applying for LMIA is before, because every one of these things is a minefield, but making sure that you're advertising and recruiting three different sources. It's very particular in terms of how and then that has to all run for four weeks continuously. And in my experience, if there are gaps in those advertisements. So the difficulty here is job bank doesn't automatically go live. You have a process where you have to register the employer, and then the employer has to be approved. And then after the employer is approved, then they can draft an ad, then the ad has to be approved, and it goes into this pending and then sometimes it doesn't get approved, sometimes job bank comes back to you and asks for things that they've never asked for before. So the problem with all this is you have to build in extra time. So let's say, in the perfect world, you have your job bank ad posted, you're doing at least two other additional means of recruitment and advertising. All of those ads have to stay live and concurrent continuously for four weeks before you would be even eligible to submit that LMIA online application. So that's what you should bake in, in terms of your timeline, at least four weeks, but add, at a minimum an extra week to deal with Job Bank. So I would say, look at at least five weeks. And then once you submit that LMIA application, you've got to be ready to go. So and then we've got those processing times on the back end of at least 40 days. So we're looking at probably three to four months best case scenario. So that's important for people to understand, Job Bank is a whole other world. So it used to be that Job Bank was a national in scope, it's free. Many of the other advertising platforms are charging employers now to advertise job. Bank has become more and more and more forced choice. So when an employer tries to register, you'll see there are a number of hoops to draw to jump through in terms of who's going to be their authorized user. You can have a lawyer designated as a third party lawyer who is able to use the job bank on behalf of the employer. And you can have a administrator for the account as well. Once you've put your employer account in there, you can draft that ad. And here's what we've been noticing recently. Mark Job Bank is making sure that employers are interacting with a service called job match. And this isn't anywhere in the ESDC rules. It's not talked about in the temporary foreign worker program. But here's what's practically happening with Job Bank, other than the fact that you must use job match. So yes, you must use job match, but they don't tell you that it is very difficult with job bank right now, because Job Bank, it seems, is tracking how employers engage with job match. So from the ESDC requirements for job match, you must use it, you must use the default setting. You cannot use the strict match, otherwise your LMIA is going to get refused. And the other thing is that there's a difference in terms of the number of stars that candidates have. So for high wage, lmias, anybody who's rated four stars or more, the employer has to actively go in and invite those people to apply. If you're dealing with a low wage, it's two stars. So it's a different parameter. But other than that, they don't really talk about anything about job match. But what we've been noticing on the ground with employers is even when employers properly do this, when they've gone through and they've invited everybody who has four stars or more, we've actually been had an incidence where an employer said that their ad who was kicked out of job bank with no notice, simply because Job Bank didn't deem them to have interacted with the resumes of Canadians enough in Job Match, so be super careful here, because there's other analytics going on in the background that are not public. And then the other thing that's important to know, as well, is there's issues with direct apply. And so direct apply is something through job bank that is normally toggled on. It ought to be toggled on, but Job Bank is also pushing back, saying, Well, you know, you didn't interact with people who applied through direct apply enough, and that's a reason for them to unilaterally cancel your ad. So there's a whole bunch of problems with job Inc. The next thing is that when you're looking at your advertising and recruitment, many companies don't realize that those ads have to run all the way up until the day you submit the LMIA, and then they also have to continue. Running. So normally it's the job bank ad that has to continue running all the way until you get that LMIA decision. So it is really difficult right now, because Job Bank used to be able to post your ad for a continuous period, and you wouldn't have to go in every two weeks and renew it. But now they will give you a maximum initial posting of three weeks, or, sorry, 30 days, and then you have to go in and refresh the ad, or renew the ad. It'll normally only give you 15 days. And then you've got to go in again. And then once it you've hit your maximum renewals on that initial ad, you have to go back and post a new ad. But if the ad is too similar to the previous ad, they won't have both of them concurrently. So on the same day, you've got to withdraw that first ad, create a new ad, make sure that it's a duplicate or very, very similar to that first one, but it's not going to be declined because it's too similar. And then make sure there's no gap in advertising and continue that on. So there's a whole bunch of wrinkles about advertising, recruiting,
Mark Holthe 21:03
and we know that the environment we're in right now is such that they want people to leave, and when a large cohort of those people are those on open work permits, post grad work permits, spousal open work permits, whatever it may be. And so when you have individuals that are in this type of a situation, the ability to stay is contingent on the ability to obtain an LMIA. So I think the government, and I don't it's hard to not have opinions on this, but it sure seems like there's a concerted effort to make it as difficult as possible for employers to get these LMIA is approved, and I don't know if they're working hand in hand. You know, when I was on the national executive, they never talked DSTC and IRCC, but it sure seems like they're chatting now, and the extent to which they're refusing applications that before would never have been questioned is a reality. We've got our colleagues across the country that are talking about really perverse decisions that are not really founded in any form of reasonableness that they're holding to and refusing to overturn. And so there's a whole group of things that are happening that we're not going to talk about in this particular podcast, but people need to be aware that this is what's operating in the background. So more so than ever before you need to be hitting all of these requirements with just a degree of forensic exactness. Otherwise, you can just acknowledge that your application is going to be rejected.
Alicia Backman-Beharry 22:36
So, so this is it. This is what's going on with LMI A's in 2025 we know that, yes, it is still possible. It most of the time needs to be in that high wage category. How do you figure high wage then go to that table. Make sure that for your jurisdiction, you're looking at the right wage rates. How long does it take? Minimum, three to four months, I would say, unless you're dealing specifically with agricultural, which is a little bit faster, advertising and Job Bank nightmares, build in a whole bunch of extra time. Keep everything live. You've got to get screenshots, then you've got to do the LMIA online application. Then you've got to wait for the LMIA decision. This decision goes to the company. So it is the company's LMIA if you've named a worker, then that's going to be on the annex. And then the worker has to go out and apply for the work permit. You can go back to our business immigration series, and we can talk about, well, that's where we talk about whether that worker can apply at the port of entry, or most of the time, they would be submitting an online application from outside Canada to apply for a new work permit based on that LMIA approval number, if the LMIA decision is negative, you got to start all over with your advertising and recruiting. So this is definitely not an easy process. It is still possible, but there are a number of pitfalls.
Mark Holthe 23:56
Absolutely, I'm just going to flip over here, just for those who are watching. You'll see if we go back it, it starts our business immigration series really starts around 100 and it's hard to believe that it's been over two years since we did this series. But generally speaking, the parameters around here are the same. So it's well worth going back and, you know, and reviewing it, we talk about a whole host of things, all interacting with the employers, ability to recruit, retain foreign nationals to be able to work for them, through both the Imp and the temporary foreign worker program. So we definitely go back and check that out. There's a lot of really, really good information there. I don't know. It's hard Alicia, like, when we look at everything that's happened, and especially with the, you know, just the changes from last year, how much more difficult it is. And we have employers that are constantly coming to us, saying, How can we keep this worker? And we're getting ready for our local immigration partnership meeting here. Year in Lethbridge, where we talk about just the needs of the community and working towards both Well, basically helping foreign nationals adjust and newcomers adjust to the to the community, well, more than ever before. Have we had employers asking for help? You know, how are we able to keep these individuals now? Lethbridge, right now is not the same as Edmonton and and Calgary, where the unemployment rates are above 6% so you can apply for an LMIA but when it comes to transitioning to permanent residence, French has has taken over the world. So we always talk about getting lmias, and if you can avoid them, you do, if a person you have speaks, you know, even a level five French, then we'll go down that path. But ultimately, the transition to permanent residence, one of the discussions I said, I said to people, is like, we need to start to partner with a local Francophone community and start teaching everybody French and setting up classes, because if they want to stay, and you as an employer want them to stay, you have to navigate your way through the LMIA process to be able to keep them. But in this time period, while they're here on this LMIA, they need to start learning French. So we'll have more on these topics as we go forward. But for the time being, this is just a little bit of a taste of what we're seeing. And never before have these lmias been so difficult. They were always challenging Alicia. But never before have they been so difficult to get approvals, and the government processing officers have just been just ruthless. So good luck. Everyone. Pay attention to the fine points, the details, and stay tuned as we talk about you know, continue to expand this business immigration series more into this new world that we're seeing in 2025 All right, thanks, everybody. We'll see you again soon.
Outro 26:57
Thank you for listening to the Canadian immigration podcast, your trusted source for information on Canadian immigration law, policy and practice. If you would like to book a legal consultation, please visit www.holthelaw.com you can also find lots more helpful information on our Canadian immigration Institute YouTube channel where you can join mark on one of his many Canadian immigration live Q and A's See you soon, and all the best as you navigate this crazy world we call Canadian immigration. You.
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